Outline size on subtitle

[Alex Asp]

Seems that outline command in DOM creates a border of 1 pixel width. Can it be made bigger, like 5 pixels to make it really noticeable. When white subtitle are displayed on a very bright background or with a black and white film they seem to merge with the picture and some people are complaining.

So far the undesirable solution is to make the subtitled Yellow.

If I manually edit subtitle XML file that I import into DOM would it help, or will it ruin the whole thing?

[carl]

As far as I know it is not possible to specify the border width in Interop/SMPTE subtitle files, so I think you are stuck with whatever the projector/server decides to use. I'd be happy to be proved wrong.

[Alex Asp]

Thank you Carl. I suspected as much.

But then, you will have to look again into the graphic subtitles with DOM as Carsten once suggested .

Because in that case the DCP creator will have the total control of how subtitles are displayed, and it wouldbe desirable and possibly preferrable.

[Carsten]

Wondering wether implementing 'Shadow' would be possible?

- Carsten

[carl]

Shadow shouldn't be a big deal.

[Anders M Olsson]

I'm new to this board. Since I work a lot with subtitles, good subtitle support is essential for me.

Here's an example subtitle as rendered by EasyDCP Player:
Font is Arial Rounded MT 30pt.


Here's the same subtitle as rendered by DCP-o-matic when set to burn in the subtitles:


As you can see, the font looks much thinner, and is much harder to read. It looks like the outline is placed inside the letters instead of around them, and the outline almost scavenges the font. Only the bones remain. It would be nice if DCP-o-matic produced a result that looks closer to what EasyDCP Player can offer. This would also be more consistent with what the subtitles normally look like on real cinema projectors, even though most of them only adds a very thin outline.

/ Anders

[Alex Asp]

Actually it depends whether you are using burnt-in subtitles created by DOM, or let DOM render the subs as an XML file. In a later case the subtitles are eventually rendered by the projector and so it looks like an outline around the letters, not inside them.

Even more interesting, that you can actually create a D-Cinema SMPTE 2010 XML formatted file in a tiny little wonderful application called SubtitleEdit, and then import it into DOM, which will happily add it to the DCP without even changing it. What's more SE will let you add a shadow to subtitles and it will be reflected in the resulting XML, and rendered properly by some projector/server combination. Even the RTL text. For what it's worth it works on BARCO/DOREMI and NEC/DOREMI combinations and CHRISTIE/DOLBY DSS 100/200/220 combinations, but for some reason not on CHRISTIE/DOREMI.

[Anders M Olsson]

Yes, most of the time subtitles rendered by the projector do indeed work fine. But I've also encountered some rare occasions when the projector absolutely refuses to show any subtitles, or doesn't play them in sync. One was an older Barco/Dolby combination. I don't remember the exact model numbers now.

It's for those rare occasions that I'd like to have burnt-in subtitles as an extra "ace up my sleeve". But if it doesn't look good, and I'm not satisfied with the results myself...

[Alex Asp]

t's for those rare occasions that I'd like to have burnt-in subtitles as an extra "ace up my sleeve". But if it doesn't look good, and I'm not satisfied with the results myself...

The only way to resolve this issue is to make Dolby talk to us. So far they have not been very willing.

[Anders M Olsson]

Since I wasn't too happy with the appearance of burnt-in subtitles, I tried to render the subtitles in Subtitle Edit and export them as a Blu-ray sup file. However, trying to import that into DCP-o-matic caused it to crash:


Perhaps its not something you can expect to work - combining a pre-existing DCP with blu-ray type subtitles?

Are there any other graphic subtitle formats that will work in that context?